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Heavy Smoke and Oil Discharge at Start Up?

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Admiral Questover

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Ok....Here is one for those with lots of engine experience.......Please.....I recently started my Yamaha F150 and the engine smoked (Heavy Blue Smoke) for about 3-5 minutes and discharged oil into the water from the exhaust.  Same thing on a second start up 10 minutes later.   This new Bennington has only 40 hours on it's first season Tamaha F150 engine.  It was carefully broken in with varying RPM and had a number of max RPM's after the 20 hour oil change.  The engine had several days of pulling tubes and kneeboarders....it had a good solid break in period.  The engine has been perfect until we tried for one more trip out and wham......huge smoke and oil discharge.  I have been boating for nearly 40 years and have all the experience that one needs to know how to trim the boat and take care of the engine.  I however am more of an inboard/outboard saltwater guy and would like some advise.   Why would I get so much blue smoke at start up and an oil discharge?  This is not a puff or two but, enough smoke to look like there is a boat fire in the marina!!  The dealer tells me that the compression test is OK and there are no obvious engine issues based on the computer.... BUT....the smoke and discharge was huge....something must be wrong.  It looks like a ring or piston issue to me but, the engine runs smoothly.  In looking online, some say that if you do not store the engine up slightly there can be oil that leaks into the cylinder head.  Others swear by storing the engine at the dock full up position.  Not sure I understand that????  HAS ANYONE HAD THIS ISSUE WITH A YAMAHA F150 i=in smoking and discharging oil at start up?  What advice from fellow outboard owners do you all have in terms of storing the engine in a down, up, half up or full up position.  I am waiting two weeks + for the Yamaha etc to come and check out the engine.....It would help me if I know about some other experiences......Thanks guys....

Need some pro answers!
 
Was the compression test done on a cold engine?  If they did the compression test after having just run it (so warm), I'd ask them to do it when the engine is completely cold since that's when you are having the problem.

Did your dealer send you away after saying compression was good and no engine codes???
 
"Warranty" is the key word, sounds like the rings did not seat properly during the break in period which is not uncommon for a compression test to not catch as there is a big variance in what is acceptable. Dealers problem now. Could also be a valve guide seal.
 
kaydano said:
Was the compression test done on a cold engine?  If they did the compression test after having just run it (so warm), I'd ask them to do it when the engine is completely cold since that's when you are having the problem.

Did your dealer send you away after saying compression was good and no engine codes???
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IDK but your advice is excellent.  I will ask that question as to compression testing of the cold engine....Thank You.  the dealer said there computer testing said the engine was run a lot at low RPM's and while we put around from time to time there are many hours of 4000 to 5500.  The dealer said things checked out but requested the Yamaha tech rep to go through the engine......Waiting 2 weeks for this guy to come to the dealer/marina.
 
Wild and Free said:
"Warranty" is the key word, sounds like the rings did not seat properly during the break in period which is not uncommon for a compression test to not catch as there is a big variance in what is acceptable. Dealers problem now. Could also be a valve guide seal.
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That is what I think as well....for there to be so much smoke and oil discharge the rings must be bad or broken and if broken the cylinder wall would be scared.  I want a new engine if that is the case because it only has 40 hours and I would not want a head replacement and tear down and compromise of factory torch.
 
Thanks for the comments.  Any opinion about storing the O.B in the up or down position and if that can have any affect on the engine oil and smoking at start up?
 
Not a valve itself but the stem, guide or guide seals can cause this as well but this will generally only cause a puff at startup, shouldn't smoke for as long as you say it does after thinking about it.  Engine storage position should have nothing to do with it at all.
 
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Thank you for your thoughtful comeback and for responding so quickly.  My fear is that my dealer / marina will conclude that my F150 is Ok and I will be winterized and wrapped only to have a big issue in the spring.........Engines do not smoke huge amounts of BLUE and spit large amounts of oil into the water if everything is perfect.  I will stay on them and your comments as to valves and compression testing when cold are very helpful....I thank you.   So glad someone with engine knowledge responded so quickly....Thank you!
 
No reason they can not unbolt the engine from the toon and winterize the boat and put it away. Then they can do what they need to the engine and have the winter to work on the issues. That's the beauty of an outboard, any quality shop should have the ability to run one on a stand if they do not have room to have the whole boat in the shop. I am not a marine tech but could have the engine off the boat and on a stand and running in about 2-4 hours
 
I keep my f200 which is essentially the same motor trimmed down right to where it changes speeds from tilt to slower trim. Mine doesn't smoke even after sitting for a while
 
It may already be to late since it sounds like it's back at the dealer for the season, but I'd for sure take a short cell phone video of one of those cold startups if possible.
 
Video is worth a billion words.
 
We had the same thing happen to our '14 model of yamaha F150 this summer.  First startup after sitting for a week it would smoke (blue oil smoke) for a few minutes then clear up for the rest of the weekend.  We have just over 240 hours on the motor after the second season of use.  We asked our dealer about the smoking and their only question was " how are you storing the motor" to which I said straight down (vertical) since we are on a lift at our docks.  The answer I got from them regarding the smoke was if the motor is not 100% vertical or slightly tilted up from vertical that oil can leak into the head and cause the blue smoke at startup.  He said the motor is designed to be tilted all the way up (tilted out of the water if you aren't on a lift) and won't smoke if stored that way.  

I find all that to be odd since we used the boat all last year (138 hours) and never had a smoking issue till this summer when we were at close to 200 hours on the boat.  We aren't big into tubing and skiing and do more cruising than hauling the mail across the lake (we do open her up from time to time though)  :D   :D so I'd say the break in we used should have been ok.  Before anyone says it's the ethanol in the fuel I can kill that notion right now as we only bought gas from the fuel dock that is ethanol free this year.  Last year we did use a few gallons of gas from the station uptown treated with sta-bil marine formula......that fuel was only in the tank for a few days before we burnt that up.

I tried to get a video of it smoking but of course the time I had the camera set up it never smoked at all on the first startup.  Seems like it doesn't do it every time the boat sits for a few days or even when it has sat for a week or more.  We tried the tilt thing to see if that made a difference and last friday the boat had sat for about 10 days with the motor vertical or slightly tilted up and it still smoked a little bit but nothing like before (looked like the boat was on fire from all the smoke)

We still have one more year of factory warranty on the motor (always been dealer serviced since new) and if the smoking at startup keeps up we are going to look into it a little more extensive before it becomes an even bigger problem.
 
They may tell you the motor is just fine, just to see if it sticks (in other words, how you react).  Laugh at them and tell them they are CRAZY if they think nothing is wrong. 

Whenever you are clearly right in a negotiation, try to force the other guy into your shoes.  Ask them if he would buy your motor at "brand new" pricing after seeing it smoke like that.  He won't even answer the question. He can't.  If he says yes, he'd know you'd know he was lying (if he does stupidly say yes, bet him there's not a court judge in town that would say yes).  If he says no, it would essentially be the same as agreeing to replace it on the spot.  So, he'll deflect the question and go down the "we'll see what we can do under warranty" path at that point because that answer doesn't commit him to replacing your motor on the spot.  But, it gets you going down the right path.  It's obvious something is not right with that motor.  Show him you won't back down, otherwise he may try to take advantage of you.  Good luck.  Hold your ground. Keep us posted.  Worst case, we'll send Andy down there.  Keep us posted on what happens.
 
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I'm loaded up and ready to roll! I'd call Yamaha directly and see what they say. They might have you work with another shop in the area.
 
When mine puffed the smoke at startup, I was advised that the shop may have put too much oil in when they prepped the motor for pickup the first time. I checked the oil, and sure nuff, the oil was high. I changed the oil, and left it half way between the fill and the full marks. No more smoke, yet. 
 
Sometimes, even after a careful break in, the rings don't seat properly. And if that happens, fuel can get past the rings and dilute the oil. Now it is overfull and thinner than it should be. It can now get into places it's not supposed too, and if the motor position is such that the oil is resting at the pistons, (down position) that thin oil can creep past the rings into the combustion chambers, and on start up create large amounts of smoke until it burns off.

At 40 hrs. they will probably suggest that the oil be changed, ring free be added to the fuel, and the oil level be monitored for a rise in the oil level.

It is still under warranty for quite some time, so i would let them do the service as mentioned and see if it clears up. The rings are not ruined, they just have not seated in yet.
 
I would strongly suggest you warm your engine up and then drain the motor oil--taking an oil sample. Send that oil to Blackstone Laboratories for an oil analysis.  See http://www.blackstone-labs.com/

I have a 3 year old F150, and it doesn't smoke the least bit or use any appreciable amount of oil when running. 

There's often something going on with your engine, and your dealer has no experience with an overly smoking motor.  An oil analysis often points an owner in a direction when there's an unknown problem.  And the analysis is rather inexpensive to get done.
 
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